LPG Discussion Forum

jaafar wrote:If installing your LPG system is for fun then this is OK but if it is about savings then this false economy.
I paid by credit card and the interests on it around £16 per month. I am saving £115 per month as I am doing 1500 plus milage every month.

That what I meant by NOT risking it with false economy

Best wishes

im having a bit off trouble understanding what you mean. your saying if im installing it for fun then that's ok but if im installing it to save money then its a false economy?

i did think about paying for it on credit card but i already have a medium sized bill i need to pay off.
luckily iv sold a few things and got a little bit off cash here and there and iv managed to save up 600 quid and its 600 quid i wount really miss so ill notice the savings off lpg from day one! 100 quid extra a month is not a bad payrise! lol

has anyone used this?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trkpa ... 513&_pgn=3

id much prefer using that to copper pipe. not sure if my kit has pipe in it yet. will have to wait and see when it turns up

If you are talking about rubber hose, you can't use it. If you are talking about poly pipe, yes you can. See http://www.tinleytech.co.uk/acatalog/Po ... tings.html

lpgnewbbie wrote:According to the wiring diagram and the pin layout of the ECU it only monitors a single line from the petrol ECU, not both +ve and -ve lines, so if the pins are the wrong way round switching the software settings will do nothing, your still monitoring the wrong line.

Err, yes, you're right!

Saw this with my own eyes today after extending the MAP sensor on a Stag kit. (wired all in white, which I didn't check when chopping the lead...)

I can't imagine why you think your going to save so much money installing it yourself. I think the minimum you can do it for is £600 and then you enter the realms of luck as to whether it will be fully compatible with your car and obd. Then you will need to have it properly certified (£65) if you want to insure it.

So you're taking all these chances to save the cost of 4 or 5 new xbox 360/ps3 games??

SnoozyBMW wrote: I think the minimum you can do it for is £600

Can get it cheaper than that, prob more like 450, depending on the components used.

SnoozyBMW wrote: and then you enter the realms of luck as to whether it will be fully compatible with your car and obd.

Will what be compatible? the gas ecu or obd? The gas will be fine, the OBD is a chance that it will or won't be, but it's no problem if it doesn't work, you still just tune the map right and it will be fine.

SnoozyBMW wrote: Then you will need to have it properly certified (£65) if you want to insure it.

Not strictly true, it's down to the insurance company if they want a cert or not, there are some that want one and some that don't, my company didn't want a cert at all.

It's good experience to do it yourself, but it's just a lot of work, takes longer than you think but the outcome is that you did it yourself, and if anything goes wrong it give you a good idea of where to start as you know all the components.

joshnosh:
how are you going to save £600?
are you saying that all the components are less than £400?

on another thread by lpgnovice, he started his project of LPG conversion more than 2 weeks ago. still not finished.

And even professionals can get it wrong.

Best of luck.

jaafar wrote:on another thread by lpgnovice, he started his project of LPG conversion more than 2 weeks ago. still not finished.

Yep it took me a few weeks to install mine, but I like doing it myself.

I thought this was a forum for lpg discussion and support etc, not a convince people to go to a professional to get it done forum.

If you have the skills to do it yourself, then go for it, if you haven't then you pay someone who has to do it for you.

Personally i think it should be against the law for lay people and hobbyists to try and install lpg equipment, this is a fundamental safety issue in the same vein as an mot and people are obviously not allowed to conduct their own mot's no matter how able they are.

And i think you will find sijones, that insurance companies are increasingly asking for proper lpg certification - and so they should!

It's up to the UKLPG to be enforcing the law on this but they seem ineffective to put it mildly.

Presumably you would also outlaw people working on the brakes or steering of their own car too? Far more dangerous if you get that wrong and find they don't work. In the last day there has been one poster with his £995 professional install with a smell of gas, but any DIYer doing his own conversion wouldn't put up with that. A DIYer doing his own conversion is going to take far more time and do as good, if not better, job than a done in a day professional installer.

Anyone can do an MoT test, it's just that you have to be certified to issue the certificate. You will find that most people with an interest in cars will check their car over before taking it for a test. They will know it should pass and, if not, what it is likely to fail on (although I've taken cars in for a test that I've expected to fail on something only to have them pass). No different to a DIYer installing an LPG system, do the work and then have it inspected and the install passed as meeting the required standard.

UKLPG have no legal status and cannot enforce any non-existant law. The Construction and Use regulations are there and they are enforced by VOSA when you go for an MoT and have nothing to do with a self appointed trade organisation.

SnoozyBMW wrote:Personally i think it should be against the law for lay people and hobbyists to try and install lpg equipment, this is a fundamental safety issue in the same vein as an mot and people are obviously not allowed to conduct their own mot's no matter how able they are.

So I take it then you want to outlaw anyone working on anything in life? I think your ignorance and lack of understanding on lpg is the reason for your misconception that it's very dangerous blah blah, as long as your sensible there is nothing wrong in installing lpg stuff yourself in a car.

SnoozyBMW wrote:And i think you will find sijones, that insurance companies are increasingly asking for proper lpg certification - and so they should!

Yep, some more insurance companies have asked for cert's, I said some don't and some do require a cert, wrongly in my opinion, as professional doesn't mean "safe" or "quality" or "not going to kill you".

SnoozyBMW wrote:It's up to the UKLPG to be enforcing the law on this but they seem ineffective to put it mildly.

Well, Gilbertd has said, there is no law on installing LPG stuff, so there is nothing wrong.


So you staying around here just to tell us DIY'ers to take it to a professional or you going to be helpful?

jaafar wrote:joshnosh:
how are you going to save £600?
are you saying that all the components are less than £400?

never said that? have no idea what your on about mate sorry lol

sijones wrote: Can get it cheaper than that, prob more like 450, depending on the components used.

works about a bit more than that for me but not by much

sijones wrote:

SnoozyBMW wrote: and then you enter the realms of luck as to whether it will be fully compatible with your car and obd.

Will what be compatible? the gas ecu or obd? The gas will be fine, the OBD is a chance that it will or won't be, but it's no problem if it doesn't work, you still just tune the map right and it will be fine.

my car dose have OBDII i know for sure so if it dosnt work ill be on the phone for a new ecu lol

sijones wrote:

SnoozyBMW wrote: Then you will need to have it properly certified (£65) if you want to insure it.

Not strictly true, it's down to the insurance company if they want a cert or not, there are some that want one and some that don't, my company didn't want a cert at all.

i WILL be getting this certified even if my insurance company don't want one

sijones wrote: It's good experience to do it yourself, but it's just a lot of work, takes longer than you think but the outcome is that you did it yourself, and if anything goes wrong it give you a good idea of where to start as you know all the components.

iv got my front end kit and layed it all out. doesn't really look that hard to be honest
not massively impressed with tinley tech so far. loads off the colours in the Manuel are wrong and the manufactures instructions i had to find myself

guys do i need to use PTFE sealant tape on the threads or with the gas eat that? mabey locktiet? or only on certain parts?

iv got plenty of heat shrink at some automotive cloth tape on the way so should be able to get it looking nice and neat

What you on about ? All the AEB looms are the same colours.
Injector wires blue, red, green, yellow. All the black traces go back to the ecu. The one wire you have left either a white with a red trace or a red with a white trace injector positive. The short blue with a white trace and black wire are for the rear tank solenoids.
Green and white together are the level sender. Your obd looms on a 4 cylinder are a green on its own (k line, pin 7 on the dignostic socket) and the green and yellow traced wires together are for can bus.
Other than that you have your system live and earth. Brown is the coil wire and you have 2 pair's of lambda wires left over, just connect the purples and leave the grey wires. The trace purple is post cat.
Everything else is on plugs ?
Best to use split conduit, you can get it pretty cheap off the bay. Trinity wiring. Its best to use conduit for the run under the car front to rear and into the engine bay. And under the bonnet for that matter.
You dont need and shouldnt use any kind of thread sealer on the connections.

joshnosh wrote:loads off the colours in the Manuel are wrong

Why, what did TT do wrong? The LPG manual won't tell you what colours to look for on the car's wiring.

joshnosh wrote:guys do i need to use PTFE sealant tape on the threads or with the gas eat that? mabey locktiet? or only on certain parts?

Previous thread
http://www.lpgforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php ... hilit=ptfe

right i shall explain

so first we have blue and black

then we have the sender

and the 2 lambda probe wires. so just to check i connect the purple one 2 my first lamba sensor and the gray one i leave. i dont have a cat so is there much point in connecting the second probe? it shouldn't be that useful to the ecu anyway should it?


now here is where it gets complicated but ill skip ahead a bit

red and black power

brown rev


but i DONT have an orange and black or an orange and black with strips
i have this! (which i think is the can bus wires?)


and this

this is what i have on my rail and reducer.. no brown wires


i wont bother with the other loom. that's got the injector cut in loom and the plugs for the new injectors plus another solenoid power line and the obd wire so all good there.

none of this is supposed to show TT in bad light im just trying to work out the obv deferences between my wires and the ones in the manual lol
ill get in contact with TT


**edit** for f**K sake it took me ages to post up all that just to reallies that the ones with plugs on are the temp ones! you can see the cable coulors now iv blown up the picture!

I was just about to say that

I built my first computer in 1993 with the help of a friend. so useful to have some one next to you.
built my second computer in 1998 on my own but at least I knew how to do it.
In 2005 I realized that building a PC will save me only £280. yes it is big money but then I thought things are getting more complex with windows XP
So decided to buy one rather than building one.
I was concerned about compatibility, drivers issues. conflict etc

I learned that how ever good I am, there are people who are even better at doing a particular job in their knowledge and experience. It is their daily job

I am sure installing an LPG system is not impossible BUT not easy.
Thats why I think giving the job to a professional is much more value for money.

consider your time: how many hours are you going to spend?
Looking at costs it seems that with professional instillation it cost £30-40 per hour. That is good value for money.

Take care

jaafar wrote: In 2005 I realized that building a PC will save me only £280.

not even close for my pc lol. cost me around £400 to build. would cost about £1500 from dell plus i can fix mine because i know how it works

jaafar wrote: consider your time: how many hours are you going to spend

quite a few? but even if i did "charge myself" my hourly wage it would still be cheaper

jaafar wrote: Looking at costs it seems that with professional instillation it cost £30-40 per hour. That is good value for money.

you must be on quite a bit off money! thats a rip of in my books lol

i would much rather try and fail than not to have tried at all. i understand why your trying to sway me but if i had to pay for this to be instaled it wouldnt be worth installing.
plus iv made a commitment already. iv bought DIY stuff and already started

joshnosh wrote:thats a rip of in my books

No it isn't, it's an honest living. When costing your job, don't forget to add in allowances for lighting, tools (e.g computer, ramp, exhaust analyzer etc.), premises (rates, rent), phone calls and of course planning and learning time, and the IT facilities that will enable you to complete the job ... assistance here is free still
You either don't have that stuff, or don't need it as you are not providing a professional service, or have already paid for it as 'household expenses'; but it wouldn't add up as a way to run a business.