Stag 300 isa2 BMW 540 help please

[hardcorepit80]

Anybody know just by looking at the valve gauge what type it is?

It's WPG-2 0-90 ohms.

Any advice on the next drilling size?

If you drill out any more , your multiplier will be too low.
Set multiplier on the road.From the picture you posted I can see that multiplier hasn't been adjusted after autocal.

[Tubbs]

I'd go to 2.6 , just out of curiosity really.
Be interesting to see what difference it makes.

[DanThe]

Ok cheers for the advice


I must have had the tank gauge the correct way round first time, spun it round and got it to register full, in the software the gauge selected was wpg4 so I have changed it to wpg2, will see how it goes as the gas runs down

Just had a bit of a play with the multiplier, ive done that many miles (over 200) the gas map wasnt changing after 8 miles so I deleted the gas map and started again, I did over 30 miles to get the petrol map so I kept it
I know ideally the maps should be gathered on similar roads/conditions/load etc but the petrol map was gathered with different loads, most of it through normal driving, so maybe that will be the best target for the gas map?
Just put about 10 miles on it to get the gas map below, roads quite busy so couldnt get much time at full load.



Am I moving the multiplier in the right way? So it ends at 1
I havnt touched the nozzles again as I found this - http://www.ac.com.pl/public/pubonline/c ... dyszPL.pdf

I know its for stag 200 but its saying 2.5 nozzles and the vap pressure is also the same, it starts out at about 0.9 and rises up to 1 - 1.06-ish when the engine is hot, not seen 1.1 yet, am I right in thinking I dont need to touch the vap pressure?

The error showing is gas injectors full open, only comes on at full load so im guessing that is down to the mapping more than the actual nozzle size

[hardcorepit80]

Update your software to the newest version 9.1.
According to your photo, nozzles are too big now.(make sure you've chosen right injector type in the program)
By the way , don't need to take a photo of your screen every time, use "Print Screen" button on keyboard and then open windows "Paint" and press Ctrl+V then save. Much easier.

For setting procedure have a look on my post here:

http://lpgforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=3 ... 2&start=45

I know ideally the maps should be gathered on similar roads/conditions/load etc but the petrol map was gathered with different loads, most of it through normal driving, so maybe that will be the best target for the gas map?

Yes, they should be gather at the same condition, it is one of the major factors to set it up properly.

Am I moving the multiplier in the right way? So it ends at 1

Looking at your previous photo, all you had to do was lift up multiplier slightly but last one shows totally different situation, probably because of different road conditions when collecting maps.
Also on last photo end of multiplier is completely wrong, last 3 dots(apart of very last one, which shouldn't be moved) not needed, you try adjust times which does not exist.
Try to get nozzles size to achieve multiplier between 1.2 and 1.4 after autocal. Forget about nozzle size calculation table, get them right for your car.

am I right in thinking I dont need to touch the vap pressure?

Yes you right, this is minimal pressure for that vap.

The error showing is gas injectors full open, only comes on at full load so im guessing that is down to the mapping more than the actual nozzle size

It is down to injectors itself, valtek's 30 are not very good, especially for your car...
If you decide to keep them (I would go for something better, Hana2000 etc.) YOU HAVE TO CHECK lambda readings at full load, if stays rich you can ignore it(error message will always be there), if lean, there's no other option than replace them.

So what you have to do is:
-update software
-change nozzles to smaller diam. or replace injectors
-set it up properly on the road

[DanThe]

Ignore the last map, I messed it up by playing with the multiplier map without reading the manual properly, ive read it about 6 times just now and its still as clear as mud

I left the nozzles at 2.5mm (first map on this page)

The print screen function isnt working on my battered old laptop, sorry, so camera phone is the only option

Ok ive just read your post and it helps a lot, the manual reads like the injector times should be adjusted, each yellow dot left and right?
But your post is saying I should just raise and lower the multiplier map (the whole map or individual dots? Not sure)

Ive just been and tried to sort it out, ive had to delete the maps and run the autocal again to get rid of the messed up multiplier, I waited until the engine was at full working temp (took it for a run first) before autocal and now the multiplier line looks much better



I did the same route of about 14 miles on each fuel, but, checking the lambda readings at full load they go up to 0.6-0.7 and then suddenly drop to 0 at around 5kRPM which is what the map is showing by the looks of it, leaning off too much, the drop in power is noticeable over 4kRPM
Can I improve this with the multiplier? Or is it a case of new/better injectors are the only way?

Injectors selected in the settings are Valtek type30/ rail ig 1/ ac giac 01 (3 Ohm) which im assuming is correct? two rails of 4 on the car. The only other Valtek 3 Ohm listed is BFC, im not sure what that means

Thanks for the help BTW

[hardcorepit80]

Multiplier spot on.

each yellow dot left and right?

Only up and down.Moving them up or down you're moving green line.

But your post is saying I should just raise and lower the multiplier map (the whole map or individual dots? Not sure)

Only single dots.
Place them more less like that:

In this case move them up so both green and blue lines match.

I did the same route of about 14 miles on each fuel, but, checking the lambda readings at full load they go up to 0.6-0.7 and then suddenly drop to 0 at around 5kRPM which is what the map is showing by the looks of it, leaning off too much, the drop in power is noticeable over 4kRPM

Not enough gas at high load, injectors fully open,which means they can't cope with demand of the engine, running lean.

Can I improve this with the multiplier? Or is it a case of new/better injectors are the only way?

Unfortunately moving multiplier wont make any difference... I've got 730i and it's very demanding,can only imagine your is even more...

Injectors selected in the settings are Valtek type30/ rail ig 1/ ac giac 01 (3 Ohm) which im assuming is correct?

That's right.

Change injectors(Hana2000 RED -no need to worry about nozzle size, Magic Jet), other option is driving like OAP

[rossko]

Before changing hardware, at least experiment with higher gas pressure, say 1.2 bar

[DanThe]

Excellent! I see the hana are rated for twice the milage of the magic, so got to be a better spend right? Should I be securing all injectors so the outlets point downwards?

I will have a play with the pressure first though as advised, seems quite obvious really, the more I drive it though the more the map drops off at the top, ive put a few dots into the multiplier this morning and adjusted a little at a time, not been very far today though (about 30 miles) so just taking it slowly for now



Ive got over 100 miles to do tomorrow so that should get the map to settle a bit.

Another problem im having is when filling the gas slows down and stops, then speeds up again, if I rock the car it speeds up quicker, its taking an age to get a small amount in, took about 10 minutes today for only 21 litres
Its a polish style filler in the fuel flap, im considering removing the ball bearing/spring stop valve out of the fill point as it just looks like a restriction, anything else I should be looking at?

[Gilbertd]

im considering removing the ball bearing/spring stop valve out of the fill point as it just looks like a restriction

That'll be fun. Without that when you take the fill nozzle off you'll not only empty the small amount of gas that would be trapped inside the actual filler, you'll be emptying the hose between the filler and the tank. If you've used a couple of feet of 8mm hose that's probably getting on for a quarter litre of liquid Propane that will be released. A litre of liquid evaporates to become 270 litres of vapour so you'll be spraying about 70 litres of Propane vapour over the forecourt.....

If rocking the car makes a difference I'd be suspicious of the fill stop valve in the tank.

[DanThe]

im considering removing the ball bearing/spring stop valve out of the fill point as it just looks like a restriction

That'll be fun. Without that when you take the fill nozzle off you'll not only empty the small amount of gas that would be trapped inside the actual filler, you'll be emptying the hose between the filler and the tank. If you've used a couple of feet of 8mm hose that's probably getting on for a quarter litre of liquid Propane that will be released. A litre of liquid evaporates to become 270 litres of vapour so you'll be spraying about 70 litres of Propane vapour over the forecourt.....

If rocking the car makes a difference I'd be suspicious of the fill stop valve in the tank.

Well, I removed the filler ball bearing/spring before to make sure there wasnt anything stuck in there, pressing the ball with a long screwdriver hardly let out any gas at all so I didnt expect it to be quite that much!

Its a new tomasetto multivalve, do they usually give problems?

Is it only the float arm that operates the stop valve? Or does it operate from pressure too? Would explain why the first fill only took 30 litres

[Gilbertd]

Only the float valve. Pumps will cut off, or at least slow down, if the pressure in the tank is higher than expected but it isn't going to be unless there is a restriction somewhere.

[DanThe]

When I took the valve out and bent the float arm round the next fill took the full amount, maybe I just need to bend it round more. I checked the pipe and there are no kinks there

[hardcorepit80]

Ive got over 100 miles to do tomorrow so that should get the map to settle a bit.

It doesn't work like that, maps will match only at the time of setting.They'll be different each time you plug in laptop, because of different driving conditions.
Still very lean at high loads... and from 2ms to 8ms

[DanThe]

Ah ok so theres no point trying to setup over more than about 5 miles then

[DanThe]

Still having problems filling the tank, I thought I'd got the gauge working, used about half a tank then adjusted the tank gauge so it was showing half, the switch gauge was working showing two leds then dropped down to one after a while and stayed there refusing to drop any further. So this morning with an empty tank I adjusted the tank gauge so it was just on the needle stop and the switch gauge showing the red led. At the same time I removed the valve and bent the arm round and up a bit more hoping it would help the fill.
I was wrong, it took over ten minutes to get eighty litres in and the switch valve was still on the red led....
I've done about 70 miles today and the gauge is now showing one green led, im pretty much convinced the valve is faulty, is there a better type of valve I can use? It's a 300 high 0 degree, I have an adapter on the outlet to take it from 6mm to 8mm so ideally an 8mm outlet, the guy I bought it from said the adapter wouldn't make any difference but im not convinced as it's still a restriction surely?

[rossko]

Why do you think an outlet adapter will affect filling or level sensor? It's not clear why you had the valve in and out again, thought it was working, but it does sound like a tangle again. Absoluetely sure the manual stop is fully open?

[DanThe]

Sorry, I know its not relevant to the filling, its just something thats on my mind, especially as its running lean at high load. I will hopefully get round to improving the running over the next few days.

The manual stop is fully open yes.

There is no tangle with the valve/pipes, I removed it again to bend the float arm round more, as it seems something is sticking, especially as the gauge works then doesnt, also when filling it still occasionally stops, then restarts when I rock the car, this is only at 50 litres plus, but still annoying, to both me and people queuing up behind, definitely not what I was expecting to happen with new parts

Is it just me or is this a common problem with single hole tanks? My previous car had a 4 hole tank and would fill to 50 litres in under 2 minutes every time without problems, for over 100,000 miles.

[Tubbs]

If you have visually inspected the feed pipe and have no kinks. Then I would change the valve. For the sake of under £40 its going to save you a lot of hassle. Is it a tomasetto one ? I've seen this a few times, undo the feed pipe. Inside the collar is a plastic thing. Push said plastic thing in with a biro. So it seats properly.
Single hole valves are very reliable. Generally. You get the very odd one. Perhaps you have been unfortunate. Perhaps you have been sent a return from the company you purchased it from. Or it's just duff....
They fill at pretty much the same rate as a 4 hole. But the gauges are generally a bit rubbish. More inaccurate than 4 holes. But they still work.

[DanThe]

Yes its a tomasetto, whats the plastic thing for?

[DanThe]

So I ordered a new valve and fitted it today, but an OMB one this time with an 8mm outlet. I set the gauge to just off the stop when the tank was empty, it moved up perfectly when filling but as with the tomasetto valve the fill slowed down at about 60 litres, rocking the car didnt really make much difference and it ground almost to a halt at 70 litres, taking more than a second for 0.01 litre to click over on the pump, took about 5 minutes to get from 60 - 70 litres. One thing I noticed is that the pump doesnt shut off completely, usually you can hear the pump make a clunking noise when it shuts off, so im sure its nothing to do with the multi valve now.
Ive taken the ball bearing valve out of the polish fill point, and will try to top it up in the morning, if that doesnt speed up the flow I will try and get an adaptor like this with the steel threaded section, as it looks to have a larger internal diameter -

The brass adaptor I have has a 4mm internal diameter, it cant be helping.