BRC Just. Seg24 ? Software and cable Wanted.

[rossko]

You could ask BRC who their agents are in your area
http://www.brcgb.co.uk
There will also be a few folk like us, who used to fit BRC but not so much now, that they might overlook. Phone up places and ask 'em.

I wouldn't be suprised if a fitter who wasn't familiar with older BRC kit was a bit baffled, the software is rather different to most.
But bear in mind your 'rip-off' folk did identify what the original problem was (lack of lambda signal).

I do agree, it probably needs setting up, especially after some passerby blindly twiddled, but I wouldn't expect miracles from that.

[Gilbertd]

The lack of lambda signal is what made me think the system is running in open loop so a manual power valve has been fitted instead. Hence a random twiddle would have an effect, setting it up and getting it working properly would have an even greater effect.

[wolseley1550d]

You could ask BRC who their agents are in your area
http://www.brcgb.co.ukThanks Rossko, this is what i have done and they gave me the garage in cardiff.
There will also be a few folk like us, who used to fit BRC but not so much now, that they might overlook. Phone up places and ask 'em.
Done this too. Mostly within 60mile of where i am. out of business/no longer do BRC.This is why i came on to The LPG DISCUSSUIN FORUM for some help and advice.though some try to help but others just try and make things harder for some of us!!
I wouldn't be suprised if a fitter who wasn't familiar with older BRC kit was a bit baffled, the software is rather different to most.i think you hit that on the head with your own comment
But bear in mind your 'rip-off' folk did identify what the original problem was (lack of lambda signal).just to confirm this one !! a wire was broken off the plug!! they did not even look at the faulty lambda or they would have seen the wire that was broken. i seen it when i returned home with my own eyes!! so it looks like they did not want to get their hands dirty!!! other than tapping on a keyboard or looking at a screen!! NO.. THEY WANTED ME TO FORK OUT £200 for an item i did not need.!!oh and plus VAT Thats why i called them a 'rip-off'
I do agree, it probably needs setting up, especially after some passerby blindly twiddled, but I wouldn't expect miracles from that.Thank you Rossko . this is why i am asking on here for the help and advice on my problem.Though the passerby did twiddle with it he did manage to get me an extra 5 miles per gallon.
I am so glad that their are people out there that are still willing to help!!! like myself!!! if i can or could help someone i would do my best if it was something i knew something about.....

[wolseley1550d]

The lack of lambda signal is what made me think the system is running in open loop so a manual power valve has been fitted instead. Hence a random twiddle would have an effect, setting it up and getting it working properly would have an even greater effect.

Thank you Gilbertd. for this info. this confirms to me that if i had software/cable i could do most by myself. and if i failed to sort it then id hold my hands up and said i tried.

i had just come back from scotland long trip and a few days later noticed revs up cold 2000rpm and drops to 500rpm when warmed !! could this be down to the power valve maybe coming loose? as it does feel to be a little bit wobbly!! but secure.

[Gilbertd]

No idea. What is the lambda reading now it is connected? Is the stepper actually doing anything? if it is, what is it doing? These are things that you can check without the software.

and having a go at people that ARE trying to help, won't get you anywhere.

[wolseley1550d]

No idea. What is the lambda reading now it is connected? Is the stepper actually doing anything? if it is, what is it doing? These are things that you can check without the software.

and having a go at people that ARE trying to help, won't get you anywhere.

lambda is connected now yes - rises and falls in voltage depending on revs as for the stepper all i can say is it clicks like on off when switch is changed, if something else i can do to check, i am willing to try that!!

having a go at people?
im not really having a go at anyone on the site, its just that some, do try and seem to be a little bit more patronizing than others. NOT all of us have got the experience that a lot have on the site, so makes us underprivileged of the knowledge that they have, but we are all trying to help each other out in the discussion forum!!!

would hope to have straight answers!! not beating about the bush in a patronizing way.!!
sorry!! if my comments seem to come across as being *having a go* not intended that way!!

[Gilbertd]

lambda is connected now yes - rises and falls in voltage depending on revs

That's not right then. It reads low (around 0.1V) if the mixture is weak, high (around 0.9V) if rich so should flip flop between the two extremes if the mixture is right. Connect a meter to it (a analogue one with a needle is better than a digital one) and see what it reads while running on petrol. Then change over to gas and see if it does the same. From what you have said, it doesn't. It may rise and fall with the revs showing that the mixture is right some of the time but if it is low at idle and high at an open throttle, that is telling you it is weak at idle and rich once the throttle is opened. Not right whichever way you look at it.

as for the stepper all i can say is it clicks like on off when switch is changed, if something else i can do to check, i am willing to try that!!

Re,move the stepper and replace it with a short length of pipe, leaving the stepper connected to it's wires. Set the manual power valve so it is 1/3rd to 1/2 way out and start the car running on gas. You may need to adjust the power valve to get it to run smoothly. While watching the stepper and your meter on the lambda sensor, screw the power valve in a little. This will weaken the mixture so should cause the lambda voltage to drop and the stepper to start to open up a little. Screw it in a bit further and the stepper will keep on opening to try to compensate for the weak mixture. Then try opening the power valve. This should cause the opposite affect. The lambda voltage will go up and the stepper will start to close.

If you think anyone is being patronising, do a search for the Toolless thread.........

[wolseley1550d]

will have a look and do as you say start of next wk as i have the grand kids here over the weekend.
thank you again for your help and info . will try looking up the toolless !!!

[Gilbertd]

Try http://www.lpgforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=8148

but allow yourself plenty of time and keep the tissues handy. There'll be times when you laugh so much you'll cry.

[wolseley1550d]

Try http://www.lpgforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=8148

but allow yourself plenty of time and keep the tissues handy. There'll be times when you laugh so much you'll cry.

Toolless is an amazing guy LOL.
hope hes not from around this area lol.
had to stop reading as put the g/kids to bed lmao!!!!

[wolseley1550d]

cold and snow out so will have to wait for another day to check lambda and stepper voltages etc.
while im here.
driving on m4 wet and cold night yesterday went to over take a tanker, got alongside it within all the spray it was throwing up!!!
thought water got into the airduct as car lost all revs? was on gas.
acted fast and got onto the hard shoulder, car would not rev wanted to die out.
so switched to petrol, was running ok checked the lights for gas and was showing one green saying still fuel?. 1/4 plus gas light lit?changes to red on petrol.
my lpg tank is a 42lt so should have 33lt to use i believe?
anyway got of motorway running on petrol fine. filled up the gas and it took 29lt was showing empty at the tank before i filled *removed cover* in wheel well.
any ides as to why this came about.
no red light to say i was empty?
mileage on refill worked out at 26mpg dropped from 29/30
does the cold weather with lpg use more fuel??
have noticed temp sits at a 1/4 on lpg and 1/2 when on petrol? car been like this from day i had it.
Or was it in passing the tanker the car THOUGHT hey im low on gas fill me up!! lol

[wolseley1550d]

Ok. BIG problem !! I THINK!!!
checked the volts on lambda today got it to sit around
.45 to.55 at tick over ?
then rev to around 3000
volts rise to 1.05 and drop to 0.10
not sure how accurate my tester is. electronic not needle.
Problem being is this !!!
when i put my hand near the temp sensor on the airbox next to ht lead from coil pack to dizzy!!to adjust lpg on vaporiser
the volts dropped to 0.02 and sounded really nice (engine wise) though only sitting at 600 revs on lpg on petrol around 800 revs
moved my hand away and it goes back up.
ht lead sit on top of airbox ... so moved it out the way to see if it would stop the voltage drops ?
sat ht lead under the small vacum pipe near the power valve and it stays at 0.02 at idle or revs ?
dont know if this is a problem or not but i have taken the car out for a spin and she seems to be going sweet.
or is it a fault and the car running better before it dies???
never got to look at the stepper for movement.
may have a look tomorrow after taking my daughter to hospital.

[mat_fenwick]

Sorry, not much time but the lambda voltage should swing between (roughly) 0 and 1V fairly regularly (maybe once a second). Your meter may average this out, depending how fast it is switching so this is one situation where an old fashioned analogue meter is better!

Hope your daughter is OK

[wolseley1550d]

Sorry, not much time but the lambda voltage should swing between (roughly) 0 and 1V fairly regularly (maybe once a second). Your meter may average this out, depending how fast it is switching so this is one situation where an old fashioned analogue meter is better!

Hope your daughter is OK

will try and find an analogue one and try again. thanks mat.

[Gilbertd]

As Mat says, the lambda shouldn't sit in the centre but they may be down to the sampling rate of your meter. Going rich under accelleration is what you want and if the revs are held up without load, it will go lean. Under load, if the system is working right, it will go rich when you floor it and the airflow through the mixer will draw in more gas.

Simply putting you hand next to the airbox, shouldn't change anything although I know very little about the underbonnet layout of your particular car. Are you moving anything else, leaning on a pipe or pushing against any wiring for instance? It may be that you have a loose or leaking hose and you are touching that? Although, the lambda voltage dropping would suggest a weak mixture but, if anything, that would cause the idle speed to rise?

[wolseley1550d]

morning Gilertd.
no arm not touching pipes etc arm was betwean airbox on right dizzy cap on left and to the rear engine water pipes for vaporiser and the main air tube onto manifold! other arm resting on wing.
i will try and take a full size picture of the layout where im talking about.
if you have ever rubbed a balloon on your hair and then slowly move the balloon away and back again that was what the effect was like .lol not so good at descriptions lol static like.
think its time for my bed.

[rossko]

will try and find an analogue one and try again.

http://rover800.gaima.co.uk/Rover800/ww ... lambda.htm
http://www.lambdapower.co.uk/diagnosis/ ... ex.asp#q11
Digital meters are 'sensor safe', analogue probably won't be unless expensive/specialist.

[mat_fenwick]

Ah, thanks for that Ross - I wasn't aware there was a danger. Thinking about it, the only lambda sensors I've played around with have been the less common titania type, which may be unaffected by taking a measurement with an analogue meter?

[rossko]

With titania, the 'power' to drive the meter comes from the host system's bias, not the sensor. Still the risk of misreading due to loading.
I think it's pretty unlikely to damage anything really, but why risk it. It certainly risks false readings except with the very best meters.

[wolseley1550d]

Thanks Rossko looks like i got a bit more to read.
been out in car all day running smooth, though feels like i need another gear.!! and when i come to hills its slowing down quite a bit.
if i not got a lot on tomorrow i will have another tinker with it.