Naming & Shaming

Message

abbas · #1 Post by **abbas** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:31 pm

I know that this forum shies away from naming & shaming, but I really want to warn people away from the guy that fitted the Romano kit in my car. Apart from the problems I had with filling an 80 litre tank over 50 litres & constant problems with leaks and gas smells invading the car, the very nice people who re-fitted the installation found the following wrong with the original install:- 1. Gas tank insecure in mounting frame. 2. Gas tank mounting frame insecure to vehicle (only 2x 8mm bolts & 1x self tapping screw holding it in place). 3. No rubber insulation between tank & frame. 4. Only 2x bolts securing gas fill valve to fill box ( other 2 holes filled with sealer). & Gas tank fitted upside down. 6. Front to rear liquid line tie wrapped to hand brake cable & clutch flexi hose. 7 All gas vapour pipes ran across HT leads 8. All wiring joints soldered but not covered with heat shrink. 9. Gas Injector positive linked to petrol injector negative. 10. Gas regulator very close to exhaust manifold. To say it was dangerous would, I think, be a huge understatement.

valmiki · #2 Post by **valmiki** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 8:11 pm

probably best to post the whereabouts of where you live? that way other forum users will be able to message you for further details...

#3 Post by **admin** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 8:42 pm

It is not a case of shying away, it is merely protecting this forum. I can see no reason in stating that you have had a problem installation, detailing what was done and letting members know that if they want any further information to eMail you directly. Then it is entirely down to the individual. I do not think posting a location would be wise as this could be open to mis-interpretation amd innocent parties being black-listed, eg. two installers in the same vicinity. We will moderate offending posts. Mostly just by removing names and locations, depends on what it said really. Damian

woody · #4 Post by **woody** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 9:35 pm

Are we talking about an LPGA memeber? if so your first port of call should have been the installer,followed by a call to Mike Chapman at the LPGA. If they are not LPGA registered then go to the trading standards. If however you chose to go to a non approved company because they were cheaper than other installers and did not do your homework properly, then you have learnt a hard lesson. Buy cheap buy twice!! Keith

#5 Post by **admin** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 9:39 pm

Been there, got the T-Shirt. Damian

woody · #6 Post by **woody** » Thu Sep 21, 2006 9:35 pm

Sorry mate didnt mean to bring up the past. Cheers Keith

andrew_kitcar · #7 Post by **andrew_kitcar** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 1:41 am

Hello, Sorry to hear about bad experiences with poor installers but how about praising good installers ? One of which i went to even though i payed more than others had quoted for other systems. System chose by installer is prins to seat leon 1.4,16 valve with plastic manifold. I found out how tidy,well tied off wires were and how much work goes into an install when i removed the system from the car 10 weeks later after crashing it. Now he is fitting the same system to a Golf 1.4,16 valve hopefully to drive more than the 7,500 miles i drove the leon for. can i name him moderator ? 2 grand to buy and fit to the leon..good or bad ?

quantum · #8 Post by **quantum** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 2:36 am

Well, it should work both ways. I've recommended two certain dealers several times, but the one time I mention an unprofessional one.... redacted. Doesn't seem to be logic.

#9 Post by **admin** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 8:22 am

I agree that we should be able to name bad installers, however does an individuals experiences provide a sound basis on the competency and professionalism of a Company. These opinions are often based on personal experiences and say for example an installers performs 100 good installations and your one happens to be a problem one, should someone be named and shamed for this? Each car and installation is different and throws up its own complications. I for one had a very bad experience with an LPG installation and would like to have plastered the companies name all over the Internet. The reasons why I did not were 1. Litigation, 2. I valued my knee caps <IMG SRC="http://www.my90.co.uk/lpgforum/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0>. This cost me a lot of money to sort out and I am only now, 6 years on gaining the financial benefits. This forum has been threatened on a number of occasions with legal action from aggrieved installers. I for one could not afford to defend any action on the behalf of the original poster in the name of 'Freedom of Speech' and I doubt contributions from members would cover the hundreds of thousands that the lawyers would earn. The fact is our society is so litigious now days there is no such thing as Freedom of Speech unless of course you are the Press where you can say exactly what you say regardless of who you destroy in the process, as it's in the public interest. If you have a complaint about an installation or installer be they LPGA approved,OR NOT contact Mike Chapman at the LPGA <a href="mailto:mail@lpga.co.uk" target="_blank">mail@lpga.co.uk</a>. They are very interested and will follow up where necessary. Damian

quantum · #10 Post by **quantum** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 2:10 pm

You are the press, and the press is supposed to act in the public interest. Installers are here to make contacts for commercial reasons, and some deserve them, and some don't. Threats of lawsuits should also be published. Especially be published. They can not sue you for the truth. They do, they will lose quickly and have to pay all your attorney's fees, although they would never take it to that point in the first place if they have any sense. Ford tried and failed, in what might have been considered a far more serious case: <a href="http://www.2600.com/news/view/article/297" target=_top>http://www.2600.com/news/view/article/297</a> You have obviously been intimidated by certain installers, and so now in effect act against the best interests of consumers, who need to know. This is corruption of internet openness. The truth is the truth, and if we all lay down, it all goes away.

#11 Post by **admin** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 2:58 pm

Bill with all due respect "I AM NOT THE PRESS". Good heavens that is about the worst insult I have ever had, and I assure I have had a few. Following your comments I have found this which may be of interest: Defamation The popularity of internet forums has seen an increase of name calling and criticism that moves from fair comment into comments that are libelous due to the defamatory meanings embodied within them. The accessibility of these forums and the opportunity to do so does not reduce or ease the legal liability for the maker of the comments, however defences are available to ISPs where they are acting as a mere conduit, and when put on notice of the defamatory material promptly remove it. Implementation of procedures to bring complaints to the attention of moderators is key in order to manage the inherent risk involved in making forums available to the public at large. The LPG forum has always operated on this basis when it comes to complaints. The tightening of the rules came out of despair on my part as I was fed up with the accusations and counter accusations being thrown at me. The policy was changed to try and prevent the posts and slanging matches starting. It is very difficult when a number of the people being slagged off also use this forum. At the end of the day you are the members, if you feel strongly about something feel free to post, we will act on any complaints and ban members if necessary. As previously stated any more threats of legal action WILL result in this forum being shut down. Free Speech, tut tut is'nt their a law banning that now? Damian

quantum · #12 Post by **quantum** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:43 pm

Quote by Damian: The popularity of internet forums has seen an increase of name calling and criticism that moves from fair comment into comments that are libelous ... 'Fair comment', means 'true comment', including statement of bad dealer experiences. I acknowledge that Abbas' prior threads got pretty angry and out-of-line. Inappropriate, that. But above he posts a list of facts, and one of those facts should have been the name of the cowboy dealer, for others' protection. He was derided above for 'falling for' an unqualified installer. Well, a customer doesn't always find out that an LPGA-certified dealer is (apparently) the best protection, and certain dealers can be pretty convincing. So let's lay off blaming the victim. And Abbas, stick to the facts. Otherwise you do damage to the community, as you can see here.}

#13 Post by **admin** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 8:32 pm

Abbas, I have had an eMail from the LPGA and they would like to take up your particular installation problem. Can you eMail <a href="mailto:mail@lpga.co.uk">mail@lpga.co.uk</a> with details please. Good Luck. Damian

andrew_kitcar · #14 Post by **andrew_kitcar** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 4:17 pm

Well if anyone needs any help with an installation or sorting problems and lives near Stokesly i can recomemd a guy for you.

ivandrago · #15 Post by **ivandrago** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 4:20 pm

Damian, Some time ago you removed my account (RockyBalboa-UK) and posts from this system when I posted negative but corroborated opinions about an installer on here. There was no defamation or slander, simply my opinion about my installation. I have tried to contact you repeatedly about getting my account re-instated and you simply say you will look into it. It has now been over 3 months. I have archived all the posts that were deleted. If you can advise me as to what bits you would like removed from them, I would still like to post my feedback about the installer in question - as many have said previously, "it works both ways" - i.e. feedback/opinion can be both positive and negative. I look forward to hearing from you. Regards.