Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

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tommo2009
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#161 Post by tommo2009 » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:20 am

I agree, this needs to be stopped. This not only looks bad but is inherently dangerous.

I can't believe there are well trusted people on here trying to help this guy.

I have seen some stupid things on here before but most of the people have followed the advice given to them. This guy seems to be incapable of heeding advice when it is given.

This is making a mockery of this site.

rossko
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#162 Post by rossko » Fri Aug 20, 2010 11:09 am

tommo2009 wrote:I agree, this needs to be stopped. This not only looks bad but is inherently dangerous.
In my view the dangerous thing would be to leave the idiocy unchallenged.

The risks this chap is running for himself and others around him have been repeatedly pointed out to him, it would not be fair to other beginners to allow his "bright ideas" to pass without comment.
We'll probably never know when he has his accident - "two die in outbuilding blaze" won't appear in the news for most of us - so it's unlikely to appear here as the best deterrent not to follow the example.
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#163 Post by jayc » Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:50 pm

Gesture of good will?

I can't see any professional installer wanting this muppet anywhere near their premises. Even if they offered their time for free (physically, rather than virtually as they are doing now) what purpose would it serve? He hasn't got the correct parts and clearly wouldn't pay out for them. No one is going to want to touch his mix up scrap, second hand, plumbing and aggricultaral parts to try and hobble it together.

I think those involved in this thread have done all they can and have gone about it the right way. They advised against it, told him what he was doing was unsafe and told him time and time again how to go about things correctly.

I'm not sure if it has been mentioned already but is there any reason why he didn't go the mixer route? The engine certainly looks suitable for a far simplier system although I really doubt that even an open loop system is within the grasps of this fella.

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#164 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:15 am

Yes that right follow all the advice given
Get your wallets out
And go to a pro and pay 2 grand for the insulation
Which is probaly why this whole LPG thing has never taken off
Yes another 30 quid down the drain from rip off pye motors just coz it has the official ford part number on and all the official billy how EC numbers

Gilbertd wrote:
Speedy999 wrote:Why are you people continuing trying to assist someone that can't follow basic instructions, can't read a diagram, doesn't even know anything about how the electrical (and perhaps mechanical) side of an engine works !

Surely after a few days it should have been aparent that you are dealing with someone who lacks basic knowledge to carry out an LPG install and at that point shouldn't someone have said to Toolless look you dont have the skills to carry on with this !
As has been pointed out, he will go ahead anyway. The man appears a total dick who, as you rightly point out, seems to not even know how his car works in the first place. Or at least that is the impression he gives, he may be trolling as has been suggested and is deliberately trying to appear more stupid than most people can comprehend. It will end up in one of three ways. He will get it done because he has followed the instructions but has not admitted to it for entertainment purposes, he will do so much damage the car will never run again on any fuel or he will create a catastrophic failure which, if the human race is lucky, will prevent further dilution of the gene pool.
Speedy999 wrote:Why I mean no offense to you Toolless but I think the reality is that your lacking some basic fundmental knowledge. That coupled with your failure to follow the instructions that your given to me spells recipe for disaster.
If you mean no offence, you must be the only person on here, the rest of us do. He seems, or makes out, that he is so thick he doesn't even realise when he is being insulted!
Gilbertd wrote:
Toolless wrote:Also
After I have sorted the above I'm going to start drilling on my inlet manifold of my engine for my screws to go into from the gas lpg
And was wondering how you think my engine would run with 4 x 5mm holes in my inlet manifold for a few days until I get them threaded
It won't. Why not do what everyone else does? Take the manifold off, drill it, tap it and fit the nipples. Then put it back on and connect it to your injectors with the flexible low pressure LPG hose that Tinley Tech will by then have supplied you with?


tommo2009 wrote:I agree, this needs to be stopped. This not only looks bad but is inherently dangerous.

I can't believe there are well trusted people on here trying to help this guy.

I have seen some stupid things on here before but most of the people have followed the advice given to them. This guy seems to be incapable of heeding advice when it is given.

This is making a mockery of this site.
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#165 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:37 am

Ok
That is the gasket made up and fitted but there is still a slight air leak and no where of telling where it is coming from
Ow well looks like I have to put up with it LPG or no LPG conversion
john_d wrote:
Toolless wrote:What would happen it the gas injectors where to far back from the engine?
it will run like a bag of shite! i had mine in my upper inlet but that was to far away so i pretty much had to dismantle my engine to get to the lower inlet (this is the v6 though)
Am I right in thinking that this is the same for having the injector too far away from the inlet manifold jets
That it will run like a bagh of shit if the injectors are not close enough to the jets

You have a zetec engine
You dont happen to have a photo of your LPG kit layout in the engine bay
Since our engine bays are very simuler and so are the engines where should I be placing my LPG injector?

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#166 Post by john_d » Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:27 am

Toolless wrote:Ok
That is the gasket made up and fitted but there is still a slight air leak and no where of telling where it is coming from
Ow well looks like I have to put up with it LPG or no LPG conversion
did you clear the mating surfaces before fitting the new gasket?

are you sure its coming from the inlet manifold? could it be frolm the sandwitch plate?

Image

did you remove/reconnect the ait hose on the right of the photo.

Toolless wrote:You have a zetec engine
You dont happen to have a photo of your LPG kit layout in the engine bay
Since our engine bays are very simuler and so are the engines where should I be placing my LPG injector?
my zetec is in my track car and is not lpg converted, its my v6 that i converted, sorry.
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#167 Post by rossko » Sat Aug 21, 2010 10:13 am

Toolless wrote:Yes that right follow all the advice given
Get your wallets out
And go to a pro and pay 2 grand for the insulation
I'm a pro, I've given you lots of free advice, (most of which you've ignored - tank angle? vapour box? insurance?).
People pay pros to do the job so that it gets done safely, effectively, and in a sensible time. (I don't think I need say more on that)
Some people just don't have the aptitude for a particular task, that isn't the fault of the rest of the world or the people in it. Me, despite all the self-help on the internet I would shy away from DIY dentistry and pay a pro ...
Toolless wrote:That is the gasket made up and fitted but there is still a slight air leak and no where of telling where it is coming from
Why do you think there is an air leak? i.e. what are your actual symptoms - rough running, hissing noises? Two weeks ago you didn't know an air leak when you had one.
Google is your friend and there are several old mechanic's tips for tracking down air leaks, go look them up. Length of hose as a stethoscope is a good starter. Use the internet to help you instead of finding silly gun pictures.
Is this a made-up gasket or the genuine one, in the end? Can't actually tell from your ramblings.
Have you checked the manifold face for flatness? Guessing you may have had this lump in a vice or something to drill it, might be twisted now.

A tip from me that you seem to have ignored, so I will repeat ... those "grub screws" you put in to block off the first set of holes drilled - check closely that (a) the inside end is not sticking out of the manifold face to jack the manifold off its seat slightly (b) the outside end isn't still fouling on something, they must be close as you did need to cut heads off. I'm assuming you did actually seal the threads with loctite or something?
Toolless wrote:Ow well looks like I have to put up with it LPG or no LPG conversion
You know you are going to have plenty of troubles if you ever get as far as trying to fire this thing on gas. Ignoring a problem and trying to fit and setup a scrap system on top of an engine problem goes beyond making a sow's ear of it, you will simply never get it to work. Fix it properly, or (please!) abandon the project.
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#168 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:22 pm

john_d wrote: did you clear the mating surfaces before fitting the new gasket?
No coz it has blue rubber gel on it
john_d wrote: are you sure its coming from the inlet manifold? could it be frolm the sandwitch plate?
What the sanwich plate


So dose it mater how far away the jets are from the injectors
Like having a 1 meter hose

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#169 Post by john_d » Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:41 pm

Toolless wrote:
john_d wrote: did you clear the mating surfaces before fitting the new gasket?
No coz it has blue rubber gel on it
you should have scraped all that shit off to make sure it was as level as it could be, this is why you still have an air leak.
Toolless wrote:
john_d wrote: are you sure its coming from the inlet manifold? could it be from the sandwitch plate?
What the sanwich plate
that plate on the above picture, the petrol injectors sit in their rail, the rail then fits into the above plate
Toolless wrote:
john_d wrote: So dose it mater how far away the jets are from the injectors
Like having a 1 meter hose
do you mean:

the hose from the reducer to the injectors

or

the hose from the injectors to the spuds/nozzles?
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#170 Post by billynoband » Sat Aug 21, 2010 1:57 pm

Best thread ever. It's a bit like giving teenagers advice.
Can't wait till it's inspected.
Good luck though.

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#171 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 2:55 pm

john_d wrote:
Toolless wrote:
john_d wrote: did you clear the mating surfaces before fitting the new gasket?
No coz it has blue rubber gel on it
you should have scraped all that shit off to make sure it was as level as it could be, this is why you still have an air leak.
But that stuffs stopping part of the air leek
john_d wrote: that plate on the above picture, the petrol injectors sit in their rail, the rail then fits into the above plate
But there is no air flow through the injector rail
john_d wrote: do you mean:

the hose from the reducer to the injectors

or

the hose from the injectors to the spuds/nozzles?
I meant the hose from the injectors to the spuds/nozzles

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#172 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 2:58 pm

rossko wrote: Why do you think there is an air leak? i.e. what are your actual symptoms - rough running, hissing noises? Two weeks ago you didn't know an air leak when you had one.
Google is your friend and there are several old mechanic's tips for tracking down air leaks, go look them up
Hissing nose and its running rough
enlight me with your perls of wisdom

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#173 Post by john_d » Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:15 pm

Toolless wrote:But that stuffs stopping part of the air leek
but you had a new gasket, you no longer need the sealant
Toolless wrote:But there is no air flow through the injector rail
but it does in to the sandwitch plate
Toolless wrote:I meant the hose from the injectors to the spuds/nozzles
1 meter is WAY too long, 300mm is the maximum accoring to most people
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#174 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:25 pm

john_d wrote:
but it does in to the sandwitch plate
No idea where the sanwitch plate is

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#175 Post by john_d » Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:39 pm

unless your engine is different to mine (which im 99% positve it is'nt), the sandwitch plate sits between the inlet manifold and the cylinder head.

it impossible for the the injector rail to fit diectly into the head and it does'nt/cant fit into the inlet, it must sit in a sandwith plate
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#176 Post by rossko » Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:54 pm

Toolless wrote:enlight me with your perls of wisdom
I already did, you ignored. Re-read my previous if actually interested.
I'll even save you some typing, but you'll have to do your own reading
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=findin ... d+air+leak
Toolless wrote:But that stuffs stopping part of the air leek
No, it is now dried-up snot and probably causing the leak.
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#177 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:39 pm

john_d wrote: 1 meter is WAY too long, 300mm is the maximum accoring to most people
Imposible
its more then 300mm from the last jet on the manifold to the centre of the manifold
So where should I fit this injector?

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#178 Post by Toolless » Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:50 pm

john_d wrote:unless your engine is different to mine (which im 99% positve it is'nt), the sandwitch plate sits between the inlet manifold and the cylinder head.
The only thing sitting between my inlet manifold and the cylinder head is the new gasket

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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#179 Post by john_d » Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:05 pm

Toolless wrote:Imposible
its more then 300mm from the last jet on the manifold to the centre of the manifold
So where should I fit this injector?
no it aint, the length of the manifold is 300 max!
Toolless wrote:
john_d wrote:unless your engine is different to mine (which im 99% positve it is'nt), the sandwitch plate sits between the inlet manifold and the cylinder head.
The only thing sitting between my inlet manifold and the cylinder head is the new gasket
so where do your petrol injectors sit?

they dont sit in the inlet!

they dont sit in the cylinder head!

perhaps they sit in mid-air? this could be the cause of the air leak?
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Re: Doing the LPG conversion; My full report

#180 Post by Gilbertd » Sat Aug 21, 2010 10:42 pm

demonicwillow wrote:Just been thru the whole thread so at least the plate wasnt attached to the manifold, so where is it, is it still on the car ?? has it even been off ?? cos if it hasnt then thats where the leak must be :shock:
Oh dear, that's another gasket he's got to buy or bodge......
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