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Posted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:13 pm
by kbs
Recently I've been calling lots of dealers to establish the best quote for a small (~£300) order.
All dealers were hepful but not all were completly clear.
One UK dealer was (more than?) a little evasive on most questions - obviously he didn't get the order.
I did order from a UK supplier but part of the order is not in stock and has to come from Europe (via the UK supplier).

The least helpful dealer made references to the dangers of buying unsupported or foriegn parts in (almost) every conversation. He never once said "Polish" but I felt he was suggesting buying from Eastern Europe was for fools who dont know any better.

Yes, we all appreciate the value of a warranty/support and that if a dealer dissapears - you may have trouble getting a faulty part replaced.

However this really felt like Scaremongering or at least manipulation of the facts to promote his own sales figures - it reminded me of two incidents in years gone by...
In the late 1980s a buthchers shop told me they could not sell me 'Mutton' as "those 'immigrants' buy it all for their curries".
In the early 1990s a burglar alarm salesman told us it was very important to have good alarms in the kitchen because "thats the first place the burglar goes - he will collect your biggest and sharpest knives then distribute them around the house in case he wakes you up".

Whats the problem here;
1) Is it me, am I just a misrable, moaning, sceptical old bore?
2) Is it the sales people, are they not clever enough to realise how bad this makes them look?
3) Is it the retaill Customers, does this kind of BS actually work on dim, intimidated or blindly loyal customers?

Have others had this experiance? Probably only applies to non-traders I suppose.
I don't want to name dealers as I may have misunderstood the verbal conversations and this could be a one-off from an otherwise excellent and honest sales team.

Re: scaremongering?

Posted: Sat Oct 11, 2014 11:30 am
by rossko
Can you tell us what facts were manipulated?

Re: scaremongering?

Posted: Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:24 pm
rossko wrote:Can you tell us what facts were manipulated?
i did previously start a reply in which I said the same as Rosko - Would need more info really.

I will say, though, that I might know where you're coming from with this.. There are still the odd suppliers whom only import one particular system, manufactured in one particular country, and some of those might be inclined to hype their particular system.

Years ago when in the UK we only really often saw Prins / BRC / AEB based systems, there were AEB based system suppliers who would say their AEB ECUs were better than the competition's AEB ECU's. I remember years ago (when all parts were more expensive) needing to replace a particular branded AEB ECU which was out of warranty, and since I was aware that most branded AEB ECUs would do the job I phone around all the AEB system suppliers. Their prices differed substantially. When I asked each why this was the case some would say theirs were cheaper because they had negotiated a better deal with the supplier, some would say their ECU's were better (then struggle to explain why), some would say 'we are aware they are the same unit, our customers are prepared to pay more for our brand because they have gotten used to fitting our equipment including injectors / reducers / ECUs, we have to pay our suppliers more for what we know is the same equipment, just the way it is. Had to admire the honesty of some more than others.

At one time most installers here might have advised against a Polish system, and probably with some justification. These days if many of us same installers were asked 'what is better an Italian or Polish system', before giving an honest reply we might have to ask 'Which Italian and which Polish system'.

When it comes to clarity and evasiveness though, I think impressions can boil down to what questions are asked. Some suppliers import many systems from multiple countries of manufacture. They may know the spec of these systems and capabilities etc very well, but ask them an overly simple question like 'what colour wires connect to the switch on system X' and they might not know without checking... Doesn't mean they're being unclear, evasive or don't know their stuff, though. The same supplier might consider switch wire colours obvious to anyone fitting the system, including himself, and not bother memorising them.. A pro wouldn't ask such a question but might ask a more techy question which the supplier could answer immediately - The pro might get a completely different impression from a supplier than a DIYer.


Re: scaremongering?

Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2014 2:36 pm
by kbs
The 'manipulation of facts' was not wrt the specifications or suitability for a Zetec engine, it was really about consumer rights. At no point was I asking for suitability/compatibility advice (perhaps thats the issue?)

What the guy was saying is probably correct for B2B sales but I was buying as a consumer. Therefore refunds would always be available to me via my payment system (providing I do it ‘properly’). Yes, if things go wrong, it may take some time for me to get my money back but I don’t believe I was at risk of losing my money.

The scaremongering refers to implying that I won’t get the kit I ordered, there will be additional charges against my bank account or that I may be reported for importing equipment and not paying the duty. Safety and faked ‘E’ markings together with ‘not passing inspections’ were alluded to.

My verbal comms are not the best, and a subsequent smaller order I placed (AEB175 kits) was by email. This worked much better. I did still get one negative comment advising me to avoid “Cheap Polish Copies” (different supplier).

On the phone, I probably didn’t sound confident enough to have understood the risks of ‘remote’ purchases from new or non-UK suppliers. Perhaps I do sound confident enough by email for suppliers not to offer such ‘help and advice’.

I may have misinterpreted the suppliers comments but I suspect that he simply dislikes the Eastern Europe competition and saw me as a gullible buyer that could be coerced to buy from him at considerably above the average price. I did buy from a UK supplier but not from him. Perhaps I annoyed him? He did say a lot for an order that was only just over £300.

As it seems like this is not a common problem, its probably one of my creating. I will be careful not to annoy in the future, probably sticking to email when ordering.


Re: scaremongering?

Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:31 am
by Tubbs
It has to be said, there is a thread on here about a certain company of Eastern European origin that seems to owe a lot of people components or money. And they are uk based.
However I am sure if you dig deep enough there are bad apples in every barrel.

Re: scaremongering?

Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:48 am
by kbs
Yes, I read the threads about a supplier not sending goods and owing money...I didn't order from them.

The order went to a supplier recommended on here.

Good to hear the issues I had speaking to the other supplier are unusual (if not of my own making).