Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

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chapman10000
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Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#1 Post by chapman10000 » Fri Apr 19, 2013 3:55 pm

Hi Guys

I have just bought a vogue bmw engine 4.4 v8 and am thinking about converting to lpg.. I know many cars are different but would anybody plse kindly tell me if they have the same car on LPG and how many miles it does etc to a tank.. Just trying to work out if I should convert across

thank you

Gilbertd
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#2 Post by Gilbertd » Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:16 pm

If they weren't still so damned expensive, I'd be looking at a BMW engined L322 to replace my two. In common with most other cars, you will use slightly more LPG than you would petrol so if you were to get 20mpg on petrol, you'll get 17-18mpg on gas. As gas costs roughly half the price of petrol, you would be looking at the equivalent running costs of a car doing well over 30mpg on petrol. The BMW engine converts well, and in my opinion is much better than the later Ford unit, too. In case anyone tries to sell you it, Flashlube is not required on the BMW engine (although it is on the Ford).
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#3 Post by andy evans autogas » Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:11 pm

I agree with Gilbert D. The BMW engine model is best. Here's a link to one of the many I have successfully converted , this one is fitted with a KME system but you'll have to look hard to see it .... Sorry about the wind noise I'll fix it later. Andy
http://youtu.be/bfrkFEYS_nY
why is it you never see the headline PSYCHIC WINS LOTTERY !!!!!!!!

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#4 Post by Gilbertd » Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:17 pm

So we can answer his question fully Andy, what size tank will a 322 take? Then you can work out the maximum range (18mpg works out at 3.96 miles per litre).
'96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
'93 Range Rover 4.2 LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
'98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, Singlepoint AEB Leo, my daily motor
'97 Range Rover 4.0SE, eGas multipoint, a project.....

Proud to be a member of the YCHJCYA2PDTHFH club.

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#5 Post by Tubbs » Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:46 pm

98 ltr full torridal, and mine seem to report very similar mpg figures. 18-19 mpg. The average on the dash seems to stick at 19.5 though !

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#6 Post by andy evans autogas » Fri Apr 19, 2013 10:10 pm

Just finishing the edit in HD should be ready in a mo
http://youtu.be/62n34XjiCBo
Range Rover L322 fitted with KME and a 92ltr tank
why is it you never see the headline PSYCHIC WINS LOTTERY !!!!!!!!

http://www.sstv.org.uk/autogas/index.html
twitter ... @autogasandy .... With lots of conversion photos !!
Facebook Andy Evans Autogas

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#7 Post by Tubbs » Sat Apr 20, 2013 6:46 am

andy evans autogas wrote:Just finishing the edit in HD should be ready in a mo
http://youtu.be/62n34XjiCBo
Range Rover L322 fitted with KME and a 92ltr tank
Only problem is that we get to see a reflection of your ugly mug in the paintwork !

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#8 Post by andy evans autogas » Sat Apr 20, 2013 9:22 am

I did think about that, and then decided to leave it on at least then we know its one of my conversions and not one pinched off You Tube ( a bit like putting a watermark on your photos ) only uglier !!!!
why is it you never see the headline PSYCHIC WINS LOTTERY !!!!!!!!

http://www.sstv.org.uk/autogas/index.html
twitter ... @autogasandy .... With lots of conversion photos !!
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#9 Post by Tubbs » Sat Apr 20, 2013 9:28 pm

:lol: :lol: :lol: a face only a mother could love ! :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#10 Post by Alun1976 » Thu Feb 19, 2015 11:28 pm

Bringing an old thread back to life! Just bought myself a l322 V8 M62B44 engined Rangey that unfortunately needs either replacing or rebuilding. I wanted your expert opinions on whether it would be best to rebuild as this wold mean the use of iron liners as opposed an alusil lined block that is factory standard. I've heard that iron liners would be better for running LPG but there is very little meat between bores to accommodate flanged iron liners and this is the only way I would go as I've also heard that ordinary liners without a flange have a tendency to slip.

Cheers once again

Al

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#11 Post by Gilbertd » Fri Feb 20, 2015 12:12 am

I've just had my P38 engine rebuilt with top hat liners but that had iron ones in the first place. On the P38, using the old Buick derived Rover V8, the original liners were not flanged so could slip. Never heard of liners being fitted to the BMW L322 unit though, maybe you are thinking of the earlier engine? Just checked the manual and it appears the whole block is Alusil with Nikasil plating on the bores. Are the bores actually damaged? If not, I'd be inclined to rebuild with new rings. You might also find that you can buy a complete secondhand engine for less than it is going to cost to get your block bored and linered, the company that did mine (V8 Developments) charge £950 just to supply and fit the liners. If you got another engine you could then build one good one out if the two.
'96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
'93 Range Rover 4.2 LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
'98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, Singlepoint AEB Leo, my daily motor
'97 Range Rover 4.0SE, eGas multipoint, a project.....

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#12 Post by LPGC » Fri Feb 20, 2015 11:34 am

Don't hear of many problems with BMW V8's in L322's, I thought BMW had sorted all the Nikasil related problems with these engines before L322 production began. I too wouldn't spend £950 on having liners done, will work out cheaper and less hassle just to fit another BMW V8.

Like others, I much prefer the BMW V8 to the Ford one, it doesn't need a lube system and is more straight-forward to convert, more straight forward than even the Rover V8s.

Lost count of the number of L322's with the BMW V8 I've converted - a very routine bread n butter job! Can sometimes be advisable to change the breather pipes at the back of the engine at the same time, they seem to go soft and can perish causing vacuum leaks - some people put this down to the pipes not being ether (in modern petrol) resistant.

Simon
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#13 Post by Gilbertd » Fri Feb 20, 2015 8:48 pm

LPGC wrote:some people put this down to the pipes not being ether (in modern petrol) resistant.
I think you mean ethanol, Simon. Modern petrol has a very small <5% ethanol content (as petrol must now contain at least 5.75% bio derived ingredient) or, on the Continent, they sell E15, which is 15% bioethanol.
'96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
'93 Range Rover 4.2 LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
'98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, Singlepoint AEB Leo, my daily motor
'97 Range Rover 4.0SE, eGas multipoint, a project.....

Proud to be a member of the YCHJCYA2PDTHFH club.

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#14 Post by LPGC » Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:34 pm

Gilbertd wrote:
LPGC wrote:some people put this down to the pipes not being ether (in modern petrol) resistant.
I think you mean ethanol, Simon. Modern petrol has a very small <5% ethanol content (as petrol must now contain at least 5.75% bio derived ingredient) or, on the Continent, they sell E15, which is 15% bioethanol.
I did meen ethanol mate!

Hope people didn't think I meant 'The Ether', as then they might get the impression I'm an alchemist or that my understanding of physics is hundreds of years behind the times :lol: I'm actually quite interested in physics, so such assumptions wouldn't be true.

I've discussed ether on the forum before - We cannot buy petrol without ethanol these days, and the ethanol content lowers the calorific value of the petrol we can buy.. Thus most comparisons between calorific values of petrol versus LPG on the internet are not true comparisons (they compare petrol without ethanol). Though the calorific value of LPG is still lower than petrol/ethanol blends, LPG calorific value compares more favorably to the petrol we can actually buy than figures might suggest.

Mind block! I wrote ether again in this post, had to edit to correct!

Simon
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#15 Post by rossko » Sat Feb 21, 2015 4:03 pm

What's gone wrong with the original engine that requires re-linering? Does not seem like an economical proposition on the face of it.
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#16 Post by Gilbertd » Sat Feb 21, 2015 6:25 pm

Agree totally Ross, if it's that bad just get a secondhand engine and build one good one out of two (or just put the second engine straight in if it's a known good 'un).
'96 Saab 900XS, AEB Leo, sold
'93 Range Rover 4.2 LSE, Lovato LovEco, sold
'98 Ex-Police Range Rover 4.0, Singlepoint AEB Leo, my daily motor
'97 Range Rover 4.0SE, eGas multipoint, a project.....

Proud to be a member of the YCHJCYA2PDTHFH club.

Alun1976
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#17 Post by Alun1976 » Sun Feb 22, 2015 5:55 pm

Gilbertd wrote:Agree totally Ross, if it's that bad just get a secondhand engine and build one good one out of two (or just put the second engine straight in if it's a known good 'un).
Previous owner let it overheat and continued to run it unitl the engine seized. Ive had a looked down the spark plug holes and I can see the top end of the conrod meaning that the piston must have exploded. I imagine the bore on this cylinder will be completely f**cked so was gonna do a rebuild based on the principle that iron liners are better for LPG, or at least I am led to believe?? It would be much easier to obtain a second hand engine and just do an engine swap though.

Are iron liners better for LPG or is there no difference to the alusil bores?

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#18 Post by LPGC » Sun Feb 22, 2015 6:18 pm

Running on LPG won't make a difference to the alusil bores. Between us installers on this forum we've probably converted hundreds with alusil bores and there are no problems.

BMW changed from nikasil to alusil in 1996 because sulfur in petrol could attack nikasil but not alusil. A nikasil engine would probably fare better running on LPG than on petrol, with alusil there probably won't be a difference except LPG vapour won't wash the oil coating from the bores like petrol can... So alusil bores should last longer on LPG than on petrol too.

Simon
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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#19 Post by Tubbs » Wed Feb 25, 2015 7:43 am

I hate pressing out liners and hammering new ones in. What a faff. Even with the correct tool. I was rebuilding a 3 cyl Massey engine the other day. Made up an oven with a space heater and some Kingspan. Got the block too hot to touch. New liners in the freezer. Got 2 in lovely. Heated it back up throughout the course of the afternoon. Last liner out the freezer. Well over 3/4 of the way in. Top chipped !! F£&@; sake !
New liner .... 3 week back order !!!

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Re: Sorry if discussed before "vogue v8 petrol vs lpg

#20 Post by Active_Lad » Thu Feb 26, 2015 2:23 pm

Do ALL the 4.4 RRs have the BMW engine? Looking around there seems to be a 4.2 and a 4.4 so wanted to be sure that I was looking at the right one as a possible LPG candidate.
Proud to have a "Gas Guzzler" :-D

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