Filler location - Jaguar XJ (XJ40/X300/X308)

[markocosic]

Hi all,


Filler location on a Jaguar XJ. Specifically an XJ8 but XJ40/X300/X308 are all essentially the same bodyshell.

Requirements:
More than 250 mm from an exhaust outlet
Somewhere where you'll struggle to reverse it into something
Somewhere where you'll struggle to smack it on the ground
Somewhere that you can hang an LPG filler off it without anything bending/breaking

Preference:
Not in the rear wing.


Go-LPG show a few examples:
http://www.go-lpg.co.uk/Filler.html

Don't like the rear wing fillers. Bumper mounted one is dubious - bumpers on these cars are cosmetic/not structural - and ugly. Towbar one is ok, but don't have a towbar on the car being converted.


Can't go below the bumper - ground clearance on these is low and the bumper hits the ground at about the same time as the boot floor. Anything below will depart company on the first speedbump:
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... cdcaab.jpg
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... 281dbd.jpg

Would using the jacking point be silly?
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... 260f97.jpg
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... 44b25b.jpg
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... 39326b.jpg

It is lower than the back of the car, but due to its location is far less likely to take a hit. (the inboard chassis rails are lower and being near a wheel rather than the centre or extremes of the car it probably won't get ramp/breakover/departure strikes)

The OEM fuel pipes that I'd be following run nearby too:
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... ba9b02.jpg
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... c1f306.jpg
http://gallery.cosic.org.uk/upload/2012 ... 2a635e.jpg

I'd mount the filler outboard of the jacking point, with the back half of the filler and the fill pipe running through the jacking point then following the OEM pipes along the chassis rail and back to the boot. It'd be horizontal, and slightly inboard of the sill.

Would any LPGA folks take issue with this position?

How much ground clearance does the typical filler nozzle/gun/head need?


Any other neat locations used on XJs?

All I can think of otherwise is to build a strengthened plate behind the indicator reflector lent and tuck a "plate style" filler behind that. (screw in the 22 mm bayonet each time you fill) Frowned upon thanks to adapter, but so long as it isn't one of those 10 mm thread jobbies I can't see a structural issue with it. Difficult to hit reversing etc but quite likely to part company in the event of a crash. Certifiable by LPGA people if needs be?


Thanks,

--
Marko

[Gilbertd]

Do it the same as most of the other bumper mounts, hole in the bumper but with the actual filler bolted to a steel plate that's fixed to the car behind the bumper. The filler must be secure enough to withstand driving off with the filler nozzle still attached so simply fitting it into a plastic bumper isn't strong enough. Hence the need for the plate behind.

[rossko]

I don't think I'd look kindly on the jacking point idea, I have seen those jack tubes wiped clean off on X300s. Hopelessly impractical for actual use I'd have thought, besides !

There's a hefty box beam inside the plastic bumper cover which would make neat fitting of a filler tricky.

[markocosic]

Might be time to look for a towbar to provide that structure then. Any tips on neat housings/recesses for fully curved surfaces? No flat area on the back of that bumper. I guess a side-entry might be possible/is flatter - how conformable are those 70 mm dia fixings that you usually see on rear wings?

(no boxbeams on the X308s as far as I can tell - the bumper is all plastic/complete cheese, affixed to the car with plastic mounts, with the structure is in the bodyshell on these models)

[rossko]

Any tips on neat housings/recesses for fully curved surfaces?

Not really. If you don't have to seal the back of it, you can bracket mount the filler brassware in just the right place behind and then butcher some plastic edging, or a standard housing, to just be a cosmetic trim for the hole in the outer panel.
If the back of the filler penetrates the vehicle interior then it must be sealed, and I think that'd be a non-starter for surgery short of some very fancy metalwork.
It might be possible to hack a complete curvy filler-and-flap assembly out of some other vehicle (look at Corsa for example) and modify the middle for an lpg filler, and let the whole thing into a big hole in the wing.

how conformable are those 70 mm dia fixings that you usually see on rear wings?

Not very. Look carefully and you'll usually see they pull the panel flat. If the panel is very curvy the plastic housing will go out of round and the cap jams.

the bumper is all plastic/complete cheese,

But there is an inner beam (of substantial plastic) so you'd have a double skinned structure to deal with there, the 70mm buckets are made for single thickness. They can be butchered for extra thickness.
It's probably possible to mount the filler in the beam with just a trapdoor in the outer skin, but it'd be a real game making it look tidy.

[brittone05]

We are just half way through our first ever conversion on my hubby's XJ8 4.0 V8.

for the filler, hubby has created a second petrol "flap" on the opposite side to the normal petrol filler and painted to match car Is this okay for us to have as a filling point x

[rossko]

Providing it conforms to the rules, summarised as
* Substantial - it's supposed to withstand a driveaway with filler attached.
* Anything penetrating the interior must be double sealed. That usually means a rubber boot over the back, to double seal pipe joints etc. With a round plastic bucket mount, the boot can vent to the outside via the filler recess as the bucket has holes in it. Else the boot can vent via vent sleeving over the pipework until it exits the floor.
* There must be no airhole from the external filler recess into the interior space, as gas gets spilt when detaching the filler.
* Reasonably convenient for use - avoiding adaptors or lying down to use it.

[brittone05]

Providing it conforms to the rules, summarised as
* Substantial - it's supposed to withstand a driveaway with filler attached.
* Anything penetrating the interior must be double sealed. That usually means a rubber boot over the back, to double seal pipe joints etc. With a round plastic bucket mount, the boot can vent to the outside via the filler recess as the bucket has holes in it. Else the boot can vent via vent sleeving over the pipework until it exits the floor.
* There must be no airhole from the external filler recess into the interior space, as gas gets spilt when detaching the filler.
* Reasonably convenient for use - avoiding adaptors or lying down to use it.

thanks Rossko

It certainly conforms to all of those rules xx